Truma Combi 4 in Broadway EL

hi all... 

Currently away at Ferry Meadows & the heatings not working entirely as it should.... 
On Gas operation it's chucking out loads of heat as you'd expect... 

We have the Combi 4E but the handbook says nothing about water not heating properly and any faults should show up on the control panel dials by showing extinguished lights but everything appear to be normal.


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Problem 1:

However despite having the water heater on (orange light) for ages it's just getting warm, before it would heat up and the orange water heater light would go out after just 10-15 mins and the water would be extremely HOT



Problem 2: 

Heating is blowing cool or barely warmish air?

I know officially we are in Winter, but I can usually just run the heating by selecting the 2 bar electric 1800w setting on the top dial or even the 900w setting, then turn bottom dial to either the gas flame icon (or the next setting gas flame icon with water heating) and the heating then works on EHU with no issues, this is the setting I usually run the heating on low when the Broadway is parked on the drive during the cold weather.


If I put the dial on Gas or Gas + Electric on the top dial then the heating works as normal, (this as I understand it is winter mode) but the water is still not heating up? 


We've hardly ever had to use the winter setting despite being in the motorhome in colder weather than today? It was 7+ earlier which I appreciate is not warm but it's not really cold either is it 

Any pointers?

Thanks

CC

Wish I could help CC, the last time we stopped at Ferry Meadows 2 Lancaster bombers (VERA) flew over.
Hope one of the forum members comes to the rescue, stay safe.
Boaby

Any re-set buttons CC ?

Cheers Boaby no worries mate 

Will get to the bottom of things one way or another, just loosing the will to live dealing with businesses that haven't a clue what quality of workmanship or customer service / satisfaction means, beginning to think I'm either jinxed or fussier than most others!

CC

Hi CC

I've just watched the video guide for your model, the Combi E ( [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] ) and it seems like you are doing everything correctly - though I have no experience of your set-up.

I can only think the electric heating element is not working, hopefully due only to a fuse. Is there a separate isolation switch for it? If you regularly use it on the drive at home and haven't changed anything, I would look for a fuse - or perhaps a reset button on the Combi unit itself???

Clutching at straws here, but it's going to be cold tonight so hope this helps.

Dave

You may find the system is heating the van up to temp first before going to water. You do have several options on the panel

Gromit wrote:Hi CC

I've just watched the video guide for your model, the Combi E ( [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] ) and it seems like you are doing everything correctly - though I have no experience of your set-up.

I can only think the electric heating element is not working, hopefully due only to a fuse. Is there a separate isolation switch for it? If you regularly use it on the drive at home and haven't changed anything, I would look for a fuse - or perhaps a reset button on the Combi unit itself???

Clutching at straws here, but it's going to be cold tonight so hope this helps.

Dave

I did wonder about fuses or reset but not entirely sure how you gain access to the Combi unit, if the drawers are removed it might be possible I've not tried? Otherwise it'll involve removal of the front panel beneath the wardrobe. 

Only thing that's stopped me investigating further is the lights are all suggesting there's no fault, and as were away I'm just heating with gas but bit annoying when you have EHU 

Will take a look at the video link, did a search earlier but couldn't find much, thanks 

CC

gef wrote:You may find the system is heating the van up to temp first before going to water. You do have several options on the panel

Hi Gef.... I've tried every combination possible TBH, I'm pretty used to having it working & working really well, knew something was wrong within a few mins of arriving on site as we usually get the burst of powerful air which heats the van up in no time, then it eases off and settles down to a gentle flow (can now only get this effect using gas) it's been fine even on the drive up until just a few days ago when screens were icy on our other vehicles the motorhome was frost free and toasty inside, as above now on gas and heating fine but water still not heating fully just warm but not hot like previously.

At home we have had a number of power cuts over recent weeks / days so don't know if this could have had an influence on something failing? there is an RCD built into the EHU wall outlet at home which is very sensitive.

Thanks anyway 

CC

Have you got the water set to 40 deg or 60 deg?

If the heating is set to air and the water to 40 deg, then the water is quite likely to be lukewarm as this setting is described in the Truma handbook as something like, " air heating will work OK, but water is a hit and miss casual affair". OK I have paraphrased the last bit, but that is the sense of it. You only get proper hot water with air heating, on the 60 deg setting.

I hope that I am not stating the obvious, but am writing in a hurry as my lady wife is calling me to attend to something or another.

Hi cc
On my van they had put the wrong card in the heater unit which caused many probs as they use an iso system fault in one van will likely be in all. Like you when it works it is super
Gef

Our Combi 4e blew the electric elements so we had nothing but trip switches operating when trying to use 230v or gas and 230v. We had the elements changed.
But, when just using gas in summer or winter settings, we get hot water within 30 minutes, good job because we use the shower daily. If you gave hot water set to 0 degrees, the heating has priority and water may not get warm
I can't think what could be wrong with yours, maybe it just needs de scaling or maybe there is air in the boiler and the water isn't heating properly.
But, there is a fuse and reset switch on the boiler underneath the plastic cover. My handbook tells me that if 12v operation is interrupted during operation it could overheat and activate the overheat protection. In this case, you need to wait till the boiler is cool and press the red reset button.
It could be as simple as that.

Hi CC

Interesting one!

In the photo on your first post the power selector should be fully clockwise rather than just on electric at this time of year.  Its hard to tell with perspective but the control selector should also be fully clockwise.

If there was an MCB, either 230 or 12v fuse failure or overheating trip (under cover on unit itself)you should be able to see (not see) light indications.

It the frost activated water dump had happened you would get heat but no hot water but I expect you would also have no hot water pressure and the pump going all the time.

As the water heating is not working on gas or electric (the slight warming of the water an ancillary effect of the room heating operation) I can only think it must be the water temperature sensor (control board) signalling that the water is hot enough although the fact that the indicators shows the water is heating belies that!  It could of course be a wiring or connection problem!

Hope you get it sorted without too much grief.  I've found Truma very helpful with queries in the past.

We have a 6e heater and although it certainly works well for air heating water heating is hit and miss even on the 60water setting. There is no real switch mechanism between the two. Essentially the water is heated through the air. If you are blowing hot air and on electric you may not get water heated even if it is on and conversely even if the water heating is off you may get hot water. This is usually the case with gas heating which is anyway much more powerful. I think that all the switch positions do is operate the thermistor switches in the air and water sections.
Our main problem is that on water heating only it smells. There is no problem if the air fan is blowing even at low speed. I thought that it was dust but am not now sure that this is the only reason.
It is not as bad as the previous versions of the Truma combi heater.

I would be inclined to take your van back to the dealer and get them to look at it, it doesn't sound right.  Our Combi 4E water heating is very efficient, heating from cold to 60 degrees in 30 minutes or less with or without the warm air heating on. 
You should be able to operate the water and hot air independantly, though it is normal for the water to heat up a bit if you have the heating on only and the water set to 0.

Hi safari boy
The heating unit goes on purge cycle at the start and if the heating duct is too short instead of venting outside it will give that strange smell inside the van it's a pity no one has told AS. The engineering inside the unit is first class.
Gef

gef wrote:Hi safari boy
The heating unit goes on purge cycle at the start and if the heating duct is too short instead of venting outside it will give that strange smell inside the van it's a pity no one has told AS.  The engineering inside the unit is first class.
Gef

Thanks Gef: AS do know about this and have extended the length of the heating ducts, to no effect. We had exactly the same problem on our last van, a Bessacarr using a Truma Combi 4,  and Swift, Marquis and Truma combined fiddled for 7 years, on and off, with no significant improvement.

Q.  ( wife of safariboy)

Thanks all.... as ajrm says we've always found the heating & water heater very efficient and effective until this blip, hot water has never been a problem with the orange light going out surprisingly quick when it's reached its temp cut out and has always been very hot at the tap, too hot to place your hand under!

I took the drawers out but there is no access hatch, there are plastic screw covers located on the panel directly beneath the draws or on the front panel so it doesn't look like a five minute job to get in there to check.

Will probably contact Mark at AutoSleepers to see what he thinks, just dread another trip 1) for it to be "looked at" then 2) "another trip to remedy the problem" if parts are needed

it just seems like every trip away we have results in something else going wrong and needing fixing, it's not the stuff going wrong so much but the inconvenience of getting things fixed. And it seems like every time somethings put right it worryingly results in something else being damaged! I've concluded that the motorhome industry operates in a shockingly poor & careless manner. Makes me actually scared when it goes in anywhere now for work to be done.

CC

Had a look on the net and found these Truma registered dealers near to you.
John.
[url=https://www.truma.com/int/en/home/dealer-search.php?country=gb&dealersearch=102&radius=50&types=3&lat=52.6139686&lng=0.8864020999999411&zip=norfolk&dealer_print=1&search_filter=Trained Service dealers&filter_location=Post code or town: norfolk. Within a distance of 50 km]Print page[/url]

[th]Name[/th][th]Category[/th][th]Address[/th][th]Contact[/th]

Anglia Caravan Engineering Services mobile service [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]	Trained Service Dealers	Norwich NR16 Norfolk [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]	Phone: 01953 861221[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]01953 861221 or 07815709944 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Caraparts mobile service [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]	Trained Service Dealers	Norwich NR5 Norfolk [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]	Phone: 01603 744922[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]01603 744922 or 07758292539 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].uk
Mcdonnell Caravans [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]	Trained Service Dealers	Caravan City, Lynn Road, Gayton, Kings Lynn PE32 1QJ Norfolk [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]	Phone: 01553 636243[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]01553 636243 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Norwich Caravans [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]	Trained Service Dealers	Cromer Road, Hevingham, Norwich NR10 5LY Norfolk [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]	Phone: 01603 755489[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]01603 755489 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].uk
John Wicks Caravans [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]	Trained Service Dealers	Lynn Road Garage, Lynn Road, Grimston PE32 1AG Norfolk [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]	Phone: 01485 601212[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]01485 601212 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].uk
M&G Leisure mobile service [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]	Trained Service Dealers	Norwich NR13 Norfolk [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]	Phone: 0844 5042460[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]0844 5042460 or 07777633252 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].uk
Stowmarket Caravans [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]	Trained Service Dealers Caravan Mover Dealer Aircon Specialist	Bury Road, Stowmarket IP14 1JF Suffolk [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]	Phone: 01449 612677[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]01449 612677 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].uk
South Hereford Motorcaravans [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]	Trained Service Dealers	Greenacres, Marsh Lane, Ellwood, Coleford GL16 7NA Gloucestershire [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]	Phone: 01594 835777[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]01594 835777 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].uk
Martins Caravans [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]	Retail Dealer Trained Service Dealers	Unit 11, Anglia Way, Wisbech PE13 2TY Cambridgeshire [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]	Phone: 01945 474666[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]01945 474666 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].uk

Cruising Comet wrote:Thanks all.... 

it just seems like every trip away we have results in something else going wrong and needing fixing, it's not the stuff going wrong so much but the inconvenience of getting things fixed. And it seems like every time somethings put right it worryingly results in something else being damaged! I've concluded that the motorhome industry operates in a shockingly poor & careless manner. Makes me actually scared when it goes in anywhere now for work to be done.

CC

I guess that's how the UK car industry disappeared. Shoddy workmanship and poor after sales service. 
When you look at the quality control going on in car factories nowadays, it's disappointing reading how many new motorhomes are sold with so many stupid faults.

ajrm wrote:

I guess that's how the UK car industry disappeared. Shoddy workmanship and poor after sales service. 
When you look at the quality control going on in car factories nowadays, it's disappointing reading how many new motorhomes are sold with so many stupid faults.

In our fairly extensive experience ( 4 British built vans, umpteen British caravans, one South African/ Brazilian motorhome) most of the faults are down to parts and devices fitted by the convertor: rooflight, fridges, heaters, cassette toilets , habitation doors etc etc. There are remarkably few manufacturers of these units and the convertor has very little choice as to what to fit.  

The days when caravanning and motorhoming were summer activities are long gone and many people either full time or go away for long periods all year round. The units are made as light as possible, for obvious reasons, take a lot of punishment when on the road and when in use, and it is not surprising that there always seems to be a high failure rate. I'm sure they could be built failure- proof but would probably weigh too much to be practical or be even more expensive.

Quite a large part of how I rate a motorhome  comes from the response of the  dealer or convertor when bits fail and the speed and efficiency with which they sort things out. Perfection would be great however !

It sounds very much like the problem with ours when it was new! and amazingly it was Marquis who found that AS had fitted a lower rated fuse than they specified.  They fitted the correct fuse and touch wood 8 years later (next week) its still ok

Be nice if it was something as simple as that Roger, fingers crossed. Have got in touch with AS but as yet no reply, not really keen on pulling apart the built in unit to check as I'm not entirely sure how to go about it without any kind of instructions.

Been in the motorhome to hoover and clean it only to find more issues and have had another moan here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] sorry folks but getting really despondent with the whole situation now 

Watch this space as they say 

CC

Hi cc
We both have the same van I think and though the book tells you there is a reset in practise it is not there. With marquise they were changing every part to find the fault until someone checked the card and found it was wrong must have cost a fourtune
And took over a month.
Gef

Hi "CC", really sorry to hear/see your woes , not good at all,best of luck getting them sorted! I am sorry I haven't got an answer to the truma problem it looks on the face of it that it should be working [no red light] but I can offer some advice on removing the wardrobe front, ive had a leak in the push fit plumbing twice under the boiler ! Don't do it unless you cant avoid it , it is only screws behind those plastic covers, but the panel is, on our Nuevo a really tight fit requiring a rubber mallet to get it back! A bit hair raising to say the least ,as the the wood around the draw is very fragile! Again best of luck with your problems   Kind regards      Paul

Thanks Gef & Paul....

Received a reply back from Mark Burdett at Auto-Sleepers who was helpful as always. I was going to have a go at removing the panel but as the motorhome is still under warranty decided to make a booking with Marquis Suffolk lets just hope they are better than their Northants branch! 

Interestingly the shower plastic shroud that's coming away they say is not covered by the warranty, also mentioned the microwave has worked its way loose again (previously fixed by Northants) again was told not covered under warranty & if required would be charged, mentioned I was not happy with the untidy silicone sealant around fridge and again was told this would be charged for, how long would it take to reseal fridge, tighten microwave, & refix shower room shroud 30 mins tops I'd say? And why should any of these basic requests be an issue even?

The booking is just to inspect and diagnose the problem with the Combi 4 and water heater, why they can't have spares available so it can be rectified in one visit I can never understand, with the symptoms reported it surely can't be that difficult to know which parts are most likely to have failed.

Will be interesting to see how the Marquis Automarq warranty works out now we are into the second year... As always will report back with the outcome. 

Every time the Broadway has been into Marquis (& even Auto-Sleepers last time) it's resulted in additional damage being caused to the vehicle... Am I worried? You bet I am!

CC

Hope you get all the repairs sorted CC, tread yourself to a bar meal up at the New Inn, I can recommend the steak and ale pie.
Take care and have a safe journey 
Boaby